Tobiano Patterns - Information and open discussion

[BlackOak2]

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That would make sense. Since shetlands in real life seem to span the entire spectrum of color coats and patterns. I don't know about NAB's in real life however.

It also does look like they follow the same lines that the Lp patterns follow which could theoretically mean that patterning edges may be able to be mapped out.

[Argent]

I believe a lot of it has to do with COI. Bitapetrone's horses have a similar COI to what my Arabians had right before I began attempting to lower it. My Arabians used to carry the two white stockings in the front and half of them sported appaloosa blanket patterns. By 130ish % I had bred out all stockings and blanket patterns yet kept constantly producing solid colored varnish. In the time those Arabians had stockings they never produced paint markings either and they had acquired those stockings from my paints and NABs that I was crossing them with to get longer faces. All of which were paint colored or had the stockings.

When I started lowering the COI of my Arabians I had foals coming out with very large appaloosa markings that covered more than half the body. All outside studs I've used so far have no recent LP genes and the studs in the past that I had used never showed patterns this large.

So I'm curious to if lowering COI or keeping COI low increases the chances of patterns showing and just how much can show. Which is why I'm currently trying to work on a second line of Pintabians on this account to test this. I've seen a line of Mustang crosses that has more varied paint markings as well as some that only pop up on AC horses too, though they seem fairly static themselves, but not nearly as static as that baby diaper pattern. My entire line of NABs of my main account sported that pattern and after I stopped that line I swore to re-home every foal that comes up with that exact pattern. Not re-living those days no thank you haha


Oh and as a quick edit. I just looked at the pedigree of that Arabian cross with the diaper pattern and I have got to say that that is quite a surprise. o.o There have been no stockings or any markings until that one stud that has the same pattern and that was a few gens back too. That's why I never say anything is completely impossible, just rather very unlikely to happen because cases like that show up here and there.

COI effects nothing. It is a prediction of homozygosity.

[Silverine]

Some more seemingly 'static' patches.

First, my gold dun mare threw a foal with her exact shoulder and forward barrel patches:






Second, my smoky black mare threw a foal with her exact barrel/hip patches:






Third, I have two foals from different NAB lines with the same forehead coverage:

[Silverine]

I think I just successfully cloned a horse. I bred my two Belgian crosses together and ended up with a foal that looks exactly like her mother.

Mother:



Foal:



Mother's foal pic for reference:

[BlackOak2]

I think I just successfully cloned a horse. I bred my two Belgian crosses together and ended up with a foal that looks exactly like her mother.

Hah!
Beautiful work!
It's always funny when that happens.

[Silverine]

Hah!
Beautiful work!
It's always funny when that happens.

While I've got you...

Any idea what color this foal is? Mom's a smoky black and dad appears to be plain brown dun, though it's possible he carries pearl (his grandsire on his dam's side is double pearl). My first guess was a really weird flaxen gold dun, but then I remembered that neither parent has champagne. So my working theory is smoky brown pearl dun. His really light mane and tail are confusing me. (I just hope he doesn't add Lp on top of everything when he grows up. )




Edit:

Here's a pic I had saved of a smoky brown pearl dun roan foal:


The shade doesn't seem quite right, but that could be simple variation. The only thing I know for sure about the boy in question is that he isn't bay-based.

[BlackOak2]

Hah!
Beautiful work!
It's always funny when that happens.

While I've got you...

Any idea what color this foal is? Mom's a smoky black and dad appears to be plain brown dun, though it's possible he carries pearl (his grandsire on his dam's side is double pearl). My first guess was a really weird flaxen gold dun, but then I remembered that neither parent has champagne. So my working theory is smoky brown pearl dun. His really light mane and tail are confusing me. (I just hope he doesn't add Lp on top of everything when he grows up. )


The shade doesn't seem quite right, but that could be simple variation. The only thing I know for sure about the boy in question is that he isn't bay-based.

I would agree that he's a cream/pearl. Although I don't see it, he could also be dun, that would explain the unusually light coloration. I think he's brown-based.

After writing all that, I find myself agreeing with you.

He reminds me of my psuedo-dilute, dun, pangare chestnuts and bays, this one is a bay:



And as a foal:

[Silverine]

I would agree that he's a cream/pearl. Although I don't see it, he could also be dun, that would explain the unusually light coloration. I think he's brown-based.

After writing all that, I find myself agreeing with you.

He reminds me of my psuedo-dilute, dun, pangare chestnuts and bays, this one is a bay:

Interesting. As mom was black it's entirely possible she was hiding some heavy pangare in there, though I didn't think that NABs usually carried that much.

Either way, I wanted to get pearl in my lines, so that's a nice surprise.

[BlackOak2]

I would agree that he's a cream/pearl. Although I don't see it, he could also be dun, that would explain the unusually light coloration. I think he's brown-based.

After writing all that, I find myself agreeing with you.

He reminds me of my psuedo-dilute, dun, pangare chestnuts and bays, this one is a bay:

Interesting. As mom was black it's entirely possible she was hiding some heavy pangare in there, though I didn't think that NABs usually carried that much.

Either way, I wanted to get pearl in my lines, so that's a nice surprise.

It always is! I'm heavily partial to pearl, I'm waiting until my infusion line is ready to inject it into the low GP project, but I have pearls and sooty dapples in the infusion line. Should really make for some nice color combinations with great coat effects.
Well, I'm hoping anyway.

[Silverine]

Here's an interesting filly. She's out of a Roberto daughter, by my half-Belgian amber champagne boy.

Foal:



Dam:



Sire: