Summer Updates

[Argent]

haven't read everything but immortal stallion ARE realistic! this may sound like nonsense but with artificial insemination using frozen semen, being dead doesn't prevent a stud from beeing used for reproduction.
I'm involved in the preservation of some endangered breeds (horses and goats) and frozen samples from studs no longer alive have been kept and is made available to breeders.

Yes, but the semen can degrade and eventually runs out.

[Pearl]

Just adding my two cents.

I actually like the addition of energy consumed while breeding. Players can still keep their immortal stallions if they want, they just can't breed them forever. And this makes sense - as lines move forward those older stallions will naturally be outclassed by newer generations. While some stallions might be nice to keep for color purposes, there are no color genes in the game that are so rare as to make a single stallion the limiting factor.

I understand the complaints about the energy restriction hurting rarer breeds. However, this is itself more realistic. In real life a horse doesn't stop aging simply because it is rare. And even with the energy restriction, a single stallion can still have a tremendous amount of children - ten per day means twenty per month, which is two-hundred-and-forty per year. Even if the stallion ages out at exactly eighteen years old, that still gives the possibility 3,600 children during a single stallion's lifetime. Yes, the owner of the horse needs to come online and actually age it in order to make more breedings available, but at the moment I doubt demand is high enough in most cases to make this an insurmountable limiting factor.

While having energy as a limiter can be an inconvenience in some cases - such as a public stud that is out of energy - I believe it changes the game dynamic in a good way. People need to put more thought into their breeding patterns, rather than just clicking on mare after mare. This may be detrimental to the methods of some of the larger "baby factory" breeding farms, but even they will be able to continue their same rhythms with just a bit of extra effort.

I agree with the previous comment about having an expiration on stud ads, though I'm not sure if time frame alone is enough of a limiter. For example, it would be a shame to lose the services of an ancient stud that still has energy to breed just because his ad ran out. Perhaps the site could check energy and time? For example, a stallion that runs out of energy would have its ad pulled after a certain amount of time if its energy remained too low to breed. However I do realize that this would be more difficult to implement than a simple timer.

Also, it might be a nice idea to have a "Low Energy" alert. This would be similar to the alerts we get for foals, sales, or successful breedings, but would let us know that someone attempted to breed with our stallion but that the attempt was unsuccessful because he was out of energy. Something like this might be especially useful for players that have stud farm accounts.

[Argent]

And this makes sense - as lines move forward those older stallions will naturally be outclassed by newer generations.

It can take dozens of breeding seasons to produce a single colt better than its sire or all of the current stallions a breeder may be using. During my most intense phases of play, it was not unusual for me to breed hundreds of horses horses in an hour, and of those I might get one replacement colt a week, if that. It was not unusual for me to cull entire foal crops and have mares who never produced a single foal I considered worth keeping. Some of my stallions, despite siring potentially thousands of foals, only had a dozen or so that were worth holding on to. Not having to age out a stallion mostly allows me the freedom to be brutally demanding in terms of what is worth using as a replacement sire, rather than settling for a colt because his sire is about to retire.

People need to put more thought into their breeding patterns, rather than just clicking on mare after mare. This may be detrimental to the methods of some of the larger "baby factory" breeding farms, but even they will be able to continue their same rhythms with just a bit of extra effort.

No one puts more effort into producing quality horses than us factory farms lol. We have spread sheets upon spreadsheets to track horses, ridiculously high expectations for our stallions and our mares, and a heartless approach to culling foals who will not advance our breeding programs. Bita and I have probably produced more horses individually than most farms on this game combined, but we also cull liberally. Both of us have juggled multiple projects at once, which just adds to the controlled chaos and degree of difficulty.

[texí]

Well, with no option to keep studs forver, which sort of * me off, because I own like 2/2 anadolu stallions and these would die quite fast... I can imagine A LOT of breeds being extinct in no time and the new breed creating process quite sucks and it's the reason why I'm not really an active player at the moment... I just think we should have the option, like in real world we do, there are foals out there with their sires being dead for decades, so we should really have the opportunity to freeze and ship semen.. and restrict who can breed to our stallions, these two things BEFORE you implement what you suggested. I really loved this game since I found it on the internet, thins game never disappointed me, until now.

[Pearl]

It can take dozens of breeding seasons to produce a single colt better than its sire or all of the current stallions a breeder may be using. During my most intense phases of play, it was not unusual for me to breed hundreds of horses horses in an hour, and of those I might get one replacement colt a week, if that. It was not unusual for me to cull entire foal crops and have mares who never produced a single foal I considered worth keeping. Some of my stallions, despite siring potentially thousands of foals, only had a dozen or so that were worth holding on to. Not having to age out a stallion mostly allows me the freedom to be brutally demanding in terms of what is worth using as a replacement sire, rather than settling for a colt because his sire is about to retire.

This is true, and I've also had many horses (stallions and mares) that never produced a single foal worth keeping. However, what is also true is that at times a stallion that may seem "worse" on the surface that its progenitors ends up being a better producer than they were.

No one puts more effort into producing quality horses than us factory farms lol. We have spread sheets upon spreadsheets to track horses, ridiculously high expectations for our stallions and our mares, and a heartless approach to culling foals who will not advance our breeding programs. Bita and I have probably produced more horses individually than most farms on this game combined, but we also cull liberally. Both of us have juggled multiple projects at once, which just adds to the controlled chaos and degree of difficulty.

I wasn't saying there was a lack of effort. You guys truly are incredible in your efforts.

To me, it's more a lack of thought to the actual act of breeding one mare to one stallion. In real life a responsible breeder meticulously checks the qualities of both mare and stallion to try to make sure they are compatible. It's more than just that either of them is amazing at one thing or another - will they work well together? The way I've seen the "factory farms" work is that you have your mares and stallions for one project and each season you breed every single mare with one stallion (or maybe two or three) and then crash through turns to see what you get. I have no problem with this way of playing, even though it is not how I choose to play. However, it lacks a sort of realism that I think is what the game is reaching for. While you cull liberally, that would not generally be a viable option in real life. Once the horse is born, it's born. You can't click a button and have it magically disappear. I feel like the energy restriction helps keep this in check - instead of swarming the world with thousands of "sub-par" horses, we are forced to be (even more) more critical of our choices.

It also forces us to look at those stallions that may seem sub-par. As I stated before, while these stallions may not have the same show ability as their sires, it is entirely possible that they will produce better foals. With the new restrictions breeders may just find that it is worth holding off on breeding their better-on-the-surface stud for a season and let his son have a chance with the ladies. Or perhaps mark the mares that did not produce well with the sire and see how they do with the son.

More than anything, to me the change makes us look at our methods and see where we need to adapt ourselves to meet it. It is a new challenge, and rather than immediately writing it of as an awful, insurmountable obstacle, we need to rise to it and allow it to change our practices - for better or worse.

[Argent]

I wasn't saying there was a lack of effort. You guys truly are incredible in your efforts.

To me, it's more a lack of thought to the actual act of breeding one mare to one stallion. In real life a responsible breeder meticulously checks the qualities of both mare and stallion to try to make sure they are compatible. It's more than just that either of them is amazing at one thing or another - will they work well together? The way I've seen the "factory farms" work is that you have your mares and stallions for one project and each season you breed every single mare with one stallion (or maybe two or three) and then crash through turns to see what you get. I have no problem with this way of playing, even though it is not how I choose to play. However, it lacks a sort of realism that I think is what the game is reaching for. While you cull liberally, that would not generally be a viable option in real life. Once the horse is born, it's born. You can't click a button and have it magically disappear. I feel like the energy restriction helps keep this in check - instead of swarming the world with thousands of "sub-par" horses, we are forced to be (even more) more critical of our choices.

It also forces us to look at those stallions that may seem sub-par. As I stated before, while these stallions may not have the same show ability as their sires, it is entirely possible that they will produce better foals. With the new restrictions breeders may just find that it is worth holding off on breeding their better-on-the-surface stud for a season and let his son have a chance with the ladies. Or perhaps mark the mares that did not produce well with the sire and see how they do with the son.

More than anything, to me the change makes us look at our methods and see where we need to adapt ourselves to meet it. It is a new challenge, and rather than immediately writing it of as an awful, insurmountable obstacle, we need to rise to it and allow it to change our practices - for better or worse.

Not the least bit true. I currently have about seven projects that I'm cycling through depending on my mood and progress. There are separate mare herds for each project, and generally separate stallions, though some cross over, and I cycle through about four until I get a replacement. If you're using just one stallion, whatever project you have will probably fail. None of my peers are working on single projects -- we have multiple things going in order to make one perfect whole. I cannot speak for those outside of my immediate circle though. And breeding large herds of mares to a small group of stallions is exactly how it works at state stud farms in Europe, specifically because they have access to the highest caliber of horses. And each single stud is overflowing with more international quality horses than there probably are in the whole of the USA simply because we don't have the concentration of quality and a governing body focused on producing exceptional horses. I've always maintained that I do not play in the style of an irl hobby breeder, but of a state stud or international farm like Coolmore or Darley/Godolphin. I produce large amounts of horses and let the less desirable ones filter out of my herd. If gelding or leasing were an option, I would probably use them, but as is I rehome horses. My macabre humor, and that of my peers, has led to the joke that we feed small countries with our culls, which is technically a realistic approach to the act of "rehoming".

As far as subpar stallions outproducing themselves, I actually just had that happen. However, his sire was my best stallion to date, and the mare he was bred to was by the same stallion, so what actually happened was a doubling of that superior sire's genes. However, the subpar stallion himself was still well within my minimum requirements.

[Winter'sDay]

Breeding Energy
Breeding horses will now use 10% energy. This means a stallion can breed 10 times but will then have to age up to continue breeding. This change is to help prevent immortal stallions kept on accounts that aren't advancing time. We would love to hear your feedback on this feature, we may adjust the energy cost depending on player feedback.

I am just wondering what happens to the stallions that can no longer be bred? There seems to be a lot of players that are no longer active with stallions still listed.
An example is
http://www.horseworldonline.net/horse/profile/123733
which if I look up this stallion's owners profile it shows that he or she has not been active since Feb 2016.
So back to my original question if this stallion is bred to 10 times and can no longer be used is he just going to hang out on the stallions for breeding list forever? I think that this would make selecting a stallion for your mare very frustrating. Will inactive stallions automatically be removed from this list or is there a way to filter inactive stallions from your search when you are looking to select a stallion?
Anyway just wondering,
Winter's Day

[Xant’hippe]

So back to my original question if this stallion is bred to 10 times and can no longer be used is he just going to hang out on the stallions for breeding list forever? I think that this would make selecting a stallion for your mare very frustrating. Will inactive stallions automatically be removed from this list or is there a way to filter inactive stallions from your search when you are looking to select a stallion?
Anyway just wondering,
Winter's Day

Not the first person to ask this, either. So, hey, Larissa / Tom, how are you going to cope with this? It will become a problem soon enough.

[BlackOak2]

Breeding Energy
Breeding horses will now use 10% energy. This means a stallion can breed 10 times but will then have to age up to continue breeding. This change is to help prevent immortal stallions kept on accounts that aren't advancing time. We would love to hear your feedback on this feature, we may adjust the energy cost depending on player feedback.

I am just wondering what happens to the stallions that can no longer be bred? There seems to be a lot of players that are no longer active with stallions still listed.
An example is
http://www.horseworldonline.net/horse/profile/123733
which if I look up this stallion's owners profile it shows that he or she has not been active since Feb 2016.
So back to my original question if this stallion is bred to 10 times and can no longer be used is he just going to hang out on the stallions for breeding list forever? I think that this would make selecting a stallion for your mare very frustrating. Will inactive stallions automatically be removed from this list or is there a way to filter inactive stallions from your search when you are looking to select a stallion?
Anyway just wondering,
Winter's Day

Personally, with this change, I think this is the biggest issue to be focused on.

Would it be difficult or involved to allow or make these public stud ads drop off in some form?

[Xant’hippe]

I write this in complete sincerity and humility. The general level of quality of horses in the game has kept increasing over the lifetime of the game, and that's because of the hard work of comparatively few genius breeders: Alpha and Beta testers and others with high degrees of knowledge, dedication, and game skill. The rest of us are definitely standing (or crouching) on the shoulders of these giants.

It looks as if the energy restrictions on breeding have a great deal of destructive potential. If someone as brilliant as Argent has serious reservations about it, Admin needs to observe what happens -- and be willing to modify or even remove it. Or make exceptions for breeders who really deserve it*.

*myself not included.